Comments on: A Modest Proposal For Preventing the Foreign People in Ireland from Being a Burden to the Country http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/ Irish Economy | World Economy | Property Market | Economic Analysis | Ronan Lyons Thu, 09 Feb 2012 11:57:49 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Niall http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-2933 Niall Thu, 24 Feb 2011 03:35:34 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-2933 Hi, Very good article, Your article though is missing something that should be brought into the equation: It fails to mention the amount of immigrants, both unskilled and skilled, that are working here in Ireland, literally, as the saying goes, 'taking our jobs'. The economic effects, I think, which, is best explained by an example: Susan is a qualified Nurse, she has just graduated and found herself unemployed, thus she has joined the dole. She is also capable of doing the same job as an employed foreign nurse This means the government is now paying a foreign nurse and an unemployed nurse. Regards Niall Hi,

Very good article,

Your article though is missing something that should be brought into the equation:

It fails to mention the amount of immigrants, both unskilled and skilled, that are working here in Ireland, literally, as the saying goes, ‘taking our jobs’. The economic effects, I think, which, is best explained by an example:

Susan is a qualified Nurse, she has just graduated and found herself unemployed, thus she has joined the dole. She is also capable of doing the same job as an employed foreign nurse

This means the government is now paying a foreign nurse and an unemployed nurse.

Regards

Niall

]]> By: Jack Onek http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-2748 Jack Onek Thu, 06 Jan 2011 20:31:46 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-2748 I am unpleased to read the article but all in all that was about what he means without mentioning positive thing that the immigrant themselve contributed to the state. I am unpleased to read the article but all in all that was about what he means without mentioning positive thing that the immigrant themselve contributed to the state.

]]> By: Derek http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1255 Derek Thu, 10 Dec 2009 08:42:55 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1255 Love your site, well done. Love your site, well done.

]]> By: Embarassed, NI « A Life in Beta http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1227 Embarassed, NI « A Life in Beta Wed, 25 Nov 2009 01:59:09 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1227 [...] As always of course – and I do recognise this - much of this is the work and views of a small(ish) minority – most of my fellow countrymen and women recognise that we know as much as any nation about the challenges of settling in foreign lands or the hospitality afforded to our people by foreign governments as a consequence of our own diaspora throughout the late 19th and 20th centuries. We are, in the main, a warm and hospitable people who recognise the obligation on s to provide refuge to those who cannot find it elsewhere but also the merits of managed and facilitated immigration. [...] [...] As always of course – and I do recognise this - much of this is the work and views of a small(ish) minority – most of my fellow countrymen and women recognise that we know as much as any nation about the challenges of settling in foreign lands or the hospitality afforded to our people by foreign governments as a consequence of our own diaspora throughout the late 19th and 20th centuries. We are, in the main, a warm and hospitable people who recognise the obligation on s to provide refuge to those who cannot find it elsewhere but also the merits of managed and facilitated immigration. [...]

]]> By: Senan http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1216 Senan Sun, 22 Nov 2009 21:49:45 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1216 Agree with you Ronan. If this country aspires to growth we need every worker we can get our hands on. We need a young country, not an ageing one. These foreigners are predominantly young. In order to pay pensioners their due one week, enough must be collected through tax the previous (notwithstanding borrowing instead). For this we need labour of all shapes and sizes. We cannot simply ignore the contribution of these people, or for that matter blame them for our troubles, now that we find our ruling and leadership class has made so many fiscal mistakes. Agree with you Ronan.

If this country aspires to growth we need every worker we can get our hands on. We need a young country, not an ageing one. These foreigners are predominantly young. In order to pay pensioners their due one week, enough must be collected through tax the previous (notwithstanding borrowing instead). For this we need labour of all shapes and sizes.

We cannot simply ignore the contribution of these people, or for that matter blame them for our troubles, now that we find our ruling and leadership class has made so many fiscal mistakes.

]]> By: Donal O'Brolchain http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1212 Donal O'Brolchain Tue, 17 Nov 2009 22:30:56 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1212 @kevin denny Good points about the economic effects. What about the positive effects over time - a different way of looking at things, perhaps some level of doing things differently - all part of the adaptation and change that societies make. Patrick Pearse's father was English, de Valera's father was ?, Lemass was a Huguenot name, Guinness ???, soccer players ? I welcome immigrants for these reasons in addition to recognising that Irish emigrants had equally tough reception in many of the places they emigrated to. What if the US took a similar hard line to our illegals - which many immigrants here are not? Sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander.... @kevin denny
Good points about the economic effects.
What about the positive effects over time – a different way of looking at things, perhaps some level of doing things differently – all part of the adaptation and change that societies make.
Patrick Pearse’s father was English, de Valera’s father was ?, Lemass was a Huguenot name, Guinness ???, soccer players ?
I welcome immigrants for these reasons in addition to recognising that Irish emigrants had equally tough reception in many of the places they emigrated to.
What if the US took a similar hard line to our illegals – which many immigrants here are not?
Sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander….

]]> By: John O'Connor http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1211 John O'Connor Tue, 17 Nov 2009 13:58:05 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1211 Ronan, Fantastic reasoned response to what is a bit of a voodoo doll subject Ronan,
Fantastic reasoned response to what is a bit of a voodoo doll subject

]]> By: kevin denny http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1201 kevin denny Mon, 16 Nov 2009 22:07:13 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1201 That Simpson's episode should be on every public economics course because it is very pertinent. And funny, as the emigrants are deported by Chief Wiggum, the locals hold placards proclaiming "United States for the United Statians". I remember Evan Davies, BBC's economics correspondent, singling it out for its insight. Even more lastly..an important argument is the "instant adults" one: they contribute to the economy and we didn't have to pay for their education/upbringing etc. That said, there are interesting issues about the effect of immigrants on the host economy and the benefits depend on who you are. There is no point in pretending that everyone benefits. They do tend to depress wages at the lower end- its competition - but if the services they produce are a big share in your basket of goods (i.e. nice middle-class people) then your real wages rise. George Borjas' book "Heavens door" is very good on these issues. That Simpson’s episode should be on every public economics course because it is very pertinent. And funny, as the emigrants are deported by Chief Wiggum, the locals hold placards proclaiming “United States for the United Statians”. I remember Evan Davies, BBC’s economics correspondent, singling it out for its insight.
Even more lastly..an important argument is the “instant adults” one: they contribute to the economy and we didn’t have to pay for their education/upbringing etc.
That said, there are interesting issues about the effect of immigrants on the host economy and the benefits depend on who you are. There is no point in pretending that everyone benefits. They do tend to depress wages at the lower end- its competition – but if the services they produce are a big share in your basket of goods (i.e. nice middle-class people) then your real wages rise. George Borjas’ book “Heavens door” is very good on these issues.

]]> By: Donal O'Brolchain http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1193 Donal O'Brolchain Fri, 13 Nov 2009 20:22:21 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1193 Ronan, Well done. This is a great contribution to having a civlised debate - teasing out the truth or otherwise of assertion Would you please send your comments as a personal letter to Mayor Kiely here Mayor's Office Phone: (061) 407347 Fax: (061) 407158 email: mayor@limerickcity.ie and all national elected representatives, through their Dáil email addresses? Ronan,
Well done. This is a great contribution to
having a civlised debate – teasing out the truth or otherwise of assertion

Would you please send your comments as a personal letter to Mayor Kiely here

Mayor’s Office
Phone: (061) 407347
Fax: (061) 407158
email: mayor@limerickcity.ie

and all national elected representatives, through their Dáil email addresses?

]]> By: Colm Green http://www.ronanlyons.com/2009/11/13/a-modest-proposal-for-preventing-the-foreign-people-in-ireland-from-being-a-burden-to-the-country/comment-page-1/#comment-1188 Colm Green Fri, 13 Nov 2009 13:24:10 +0000 http://www.ronanlyons.com/?p=1032#comment-1188 Good man ronan. Good man ronan.

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